New Age Addition discussion thread - Avians

[Lydias]

We're considering bringing back Avians to celebrate the first age of WoL on the new code. As a starting point for a discussion here are the proposed mod values for Avians.

+75% Birth Rates
-25% Attack Time
Immunity to Fog
+1 Defense Specialist Strength
+20% Military Losses in Combat
No Specialist Credits from Combat
6/4 Elite - $800

Please discuss constructively in this thread only.

[Avenger]

I have nothing against bringing the avian back, it was one of my favorites, however... this worked some years ago, but it's a bit overpowered now.

[Bijo]

nice!
good job!!!!

(good thing i saved all the races on my calc)

[Malm]

Yey, Avian is back <3 ze birdies

on a more practical note however: Both higher losses and no spec credits seems rather harsh, 1 or the other should be enough imo

[Titan TA]

I agree, over powered!

[Luc]

-25% attack time is extremely powerful. Immunity to Fog & +1 Defense Specialist Strength already exists elsewhere. I dunno... I loved avian, but I'm not sure it's a good idea to bring them back

[Blitz]

My first comment will not be a constructive one :P : can't you make a new race rather than keep bringing back undeads, avians.

Now constructively:
- they seem underpowered to me.. the losses are way too high. If you have a KD with players that are all 25 online at each intra-war wave than you might have a chance to win the war fast until min time, else you will get fat, lose a lot of army, train nothing(no credits, no income bonusses, no science bonuss, nothing)
- you can use them in combo with other races.. but than you will not be able to keep armies in the same hours, but spread them around... wich we all know it's not good.

In conclusion.. numbers might look good, but practicly they will be weak in wars.
P.S. These kind of very fast races also make xloging more important.. so more used.

[Titan TA]

-25% attack times, with Warriors -15% and add 20-25% rax!! I will go unemployed ;)

[Avenger]

No enhanced def specialist then, so humans can keep their unique ability.
I'd also add that the elf has the 6/4 elite already. Maybe change the avian one to 7/3 and put "no access to stables"

[Zauper]

The issue is the dual bonuses that exist -- the 6/4 elite, and the +1 defspec already exist as other bonuses for other races.

Immunity to fog also exists, though duplication of that is not as terrible. I suggest the following:
1) Re-introduce bloodlust (is that possible? If not; just give them a flat +4-5% OME or something) which was +10% ome; +20% losses.
2) Give them both enhanced specs (+1 ospec and +1 dspec); but no access to stables. Make the elite 7/3, as suggested by Avenger.

Duplication of the bonuses is a bit of an issue, though. not the end of the world, and it would take a lot of effort to re-do all the bonuses. Hmm.

[Luc]

20% losses isn't the end of the world, you just run more hospitals. avian warriors in a skd capable of banking would be scary

[DHaran]

-25% attack time is a reason NOT to run warrior.

[Luc]

-25% attack time is a reason NOT to run warrior.

Why? An avian warrior gets around 8 hour attack times WITHOUT rax in war. Add some rax, a bank to help ppl keep their army up & active players and you're gonna pwn

[Coruscale]

Could just simply slide the casualty losses up to offset the double bonuses. Purpose would be to place them under the category of being a defaulted specialized class.

What I mean by that is force them into a position to be an attacker that has limited long-term capabilities or require an economical build incorporation that disables their ability to fully utilize all bonuses. This could generally balance the race out, given other races are able to utilize everything they've got to it's general full effect, while Avian's would need to gauge what they use.

[Coruscale]

Why? An avian warrior gets around 8 hour attack times WITHOUT rax in war. Add some rax, a bank to help ppl keep their army up & active players and you're gonna pwn

Values are multiplicative, not additive - so the effects of barracks and Warrior are diminishing in return.